Originally Posted by Bob FM:
Kernow, I agree, I do find it amazing that the intellectual elite on here do not seem to grasp that simple principle that the whole time the EU exists and we are part of it, Britain will never be free.

Bob, I think you might realise that posters on this forum, by and large and certainly those who you are referring to, absolutely realise your point about the EU.

However, 'we' realise that focussing solely or mainly on the EU has not been a succesful policy. You can harp on about the problems of the EU, freedom etc but when it comes down to it people put in lower (wrongly) in their priority list than you and I might. This is one reason why UKIP has not been successful in UK GE or local elections, and only marginally successful in Euro elections.

Frankly, there are very few people in the UK who see the issue of the EU as the main reason for their voting pattern. UKIP plays an important role in promoting awareness of the EU as an issue, and possibly to some extend as a pressure group but as a serious political party it has to shake off the 'single issue' perception.

UKIP has not done this, shows no sign of doing this and the new website was an opportnity, IMHO, to show the country that UKIP is a full political party. Instead, we get more of the same - EU,EU, EU. And UKIP has done that for the last ten years, and gotten nowhere, relatively speaking.

Of course Bob, we in the 'intellectual elite" (! :-) ) understand it is easier for you to make a massive generalisation and slag off people instead of making a more measured, mature and considered approach. You really can't debate, can you?
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Originally Posted by Bob FM:
mrabody, at the risk of repeating myself, we did exactly that in Swindon, we pushed them into 8 of 11, 4th places. The other 3 were the leader of the lib-dem group and long standing councillors.

My group were rightly proud of this achievement and we continually push the goal posts with our campaigns. There are those on here who would say we were wasting our time. If that is there view then their self professed superior knowledge of politics would seem to be at odds with what us mere mortals are finding on the streets. People want grass roots change.

We as a party need to keep sowing the seeds, it is working in areas where the Group believe the message that they are putting out. We do not need those who think we cannot win, they are a liability that no party would want.

In Runnymede we have beaten the Lib Dems into fourth place as well, although to be frank they were never very strong here (they've only elected one councillor in the last fifteen years). In fact the Lib Dems have been standing in fewer and fewer wards over the past few years whereas we have been standing in more. If we had enough activists to stand in every ward we would outpoll Labour as well and be the clear second choice of the voters in Runnymede to the Tories. Of course there aren't any prizes for second place but on the other hand but once we are in that position we would be able to create the sense that we are THE alternative to the Tories.
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The website is a vast improvement and much easier to navigate. It looks more professional and seems to make use of video, at last.

As proved by some of the comments in this thread, UKIP is damned whichever way it turns.

As for the fact it make sus look like an EU pressure group - guess what? we are not yet taken seriously on domestic issues! While we have MEPs and are taken seriously on EU issues then we have to shout it from the rooftops. It is our specialist subject. It would be very strange to see the UKIP website with minimal content about the EU.
I agree entirely that we have to move towards presenting a positive domestic manifesto on which we fight, EU withdrawal being a necessary side affect, but we are not there yet.

All in all I would say the new site is pretty good. Any chance we can stop the moaning? Didn't think so!
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There is little point in attempting to debate with those who consider you intellectually their inferiors, had you read my post correctly I was actually advocating more domestic activity as a means of achieving the aims. But I guess I didn't use enough big words and the message one would assume was lost, but I guess I'm use to communicating with voters on the street who clearly understand what I say to them.
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Originally Posted by harryaldridge:
All in all I would say the new site is pretty good. Any chance we can stop the moaning? Didn't think so!

Harry, it's not moaning, it's discussion. The whole pressure group/party argument is the longest running discussion in UKIP's history, and as long as there are members it isn't going away. Both are perfectly valid strategies.
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Originally Posted by Bob FM:
I was able to access the site without any problems. I have to say that immediately I saw the site it raised a major concern for me which I have already taken up. Given my stance on honesty and integrity if the explanation I receive is not satisfactory, I will really be considering my position.

Bob, I'm curious: As I said, I generally like the website, and have been involved with UKIP websites for years - I even ran the national website, once, so full understand they can be controversial. But, what is your major concern, and what do you consider an acceptable timeframe for a response? As a "think twice" voter, I will fully understand if you reply that the specifics are none of the forum's business, for now :-)
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Guys, an ideas why the old website is STILL coming up for me?
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Try clearing your browser history, cache and refreshing. Which broswer/ OS combo are you using, including versions?
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Originally Posted by mrabody:
I understand that this will be one of the tasks assigned to our new press officer whose identity will no doubt be revealed publicly very soon and who I think is well-suited to the job.

Cooee!

Thanks for saying nice things about me there.

Bob, I'm not fully onboard yet and the basics of the website won't be my responsibility (the news that goes on it will be in part) when I am. But if you've got a problem with it, let me know would you? By PM if you prefer.
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Tim have PM'd you.
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